Sauerbraten Colaboration

by SilentFox2000 on 02/17/2006 13:04, 41 messages, last message: 02/23/2006 20:20, 17744 views, last view: 05/18/2024 23:05

I was thinking that all mappers, music makers, and modders get together and make a slew of maps on one cgz. file. But everyone has to be willing to do that of course.
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#13: Re: ..

by >driAn<. on 02/18/2006 21:16, refers to #12

A first step could be a relaunch of the wiki (its read-only atm) and setting up a page about 'sauerbraten modding' where we describe what is possible and what not. A menu-button 'modding' at the left of the main page could link to it, to make it clear to everyone.

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#14: ..

by Passa on 02/18/2006 22:18, refers to #10

maKKe:
i never said sauerbraten was not a game, i was pointing out this should be a 'game' with complete new content rather than a mod. when i said wait for a stable release i was saying to wait for the next release until coding anything. the difference (i was hoping) between this idea and another of the MMORPG ones is that SilentFox suggested a community project that everyone gets behind.

Aardappel:
i didnt say that i wanted to make my OWN game and neither did SilentFox. he actually suggested a community project. and its not like im trying to create my 'idea' or SilentFox is trying to create his 'idea'. all i have put forward is that it should be single-player and should have a frontend. so im not trying to take your 'FPS maker' and turn it into a 'game' i can call my own.

the first thing my friends say when they see the game is "omg, what is that ogre thing man its gay". an easy to use simple 'game' to promote sauer would be cool and help get sauer to more people. the 'game' could be singleplayer only, and the multiplayer features could even just be cut out of the menus.cfg file. whenever the game frontend is quit, it directs the person to the cube engine homepage.

if this project was helped by people on these forums, it could be a really good way of promoting sauer. the problem with getting content? youre all right, its too hard to make and very hard to find any that you can use legally. so this 'game idea' will probably also slip off the recent thread list, just like the other thousands of ideas before it.

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#15: game design document

by da_555_id on 02/18/2006 22:32

i have an idea to attract/motivation
content creation for Sauerbraten RPG.
Aard, you might think about posting
some specific game design documents.
outlining what you want this game to be.
i\\\\\\\'d love to contribute, but i feel like
it\\\\\\\'s kind of futile without knowing what
you\\\\\\\'re looking for. I get the feeling that the RPG you have in mind for Sauer is a knight-wizard-dragon kind of thing from the couple of maps that are out there.
but going into somemore detail would
get people interested. i understand that
you might want this game to grow organically and not stifle anyones creativity. but we need a path. think characters, mood, realism vs cartoony.
more people are likely to walk down a road that has been mapped out for them.

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#16: ..

by SilentFox2000 on 02/19/2006 00:33

I never said anything about changing the engine. Just make a multiplayer map pack from the game using the editor. These guys are in another dimension. "Let's change this!" and "Let's change that!". When I mean by Collaboration is not changing a damn thing in engine or gameplay. Just build maps, when music is supported, use that.
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#17: ..

by makkE on 02/19/2006 00:50

I know it wasn´t the intention of the thread.
A map-pack.. well sauerbraten and cube are continiously updated "map packs" so to speak. Just make a map and post it here or on quadropolis, and if it´s good, it will be in the next release.

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#18: Proper editor...?

by Lava C. on 02/19/2006 00:54

Hi, first off, Cube is nifty little engine and as a game it's fun too, but, as I do some mapping for Quake II, I would like to see a proper editor, similar to Radiant/WorldCraft. What are the chances of you guys coding such a thing?

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#19: Re: Proper editor...?

by CC_machine4 on 02/19/2006 01:01, refers to #18

Lava C., cube already has it's own built in editor which is easy to pick up and use, and which is one of cube's great features over other engines.

and why isnt cube's editor "proper"? because you havent got the hang of it yet? because it's different from everything else? :/

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#20: Re: ..

by Aardappel_ on 02/19/2006 01:33, refers to #14

Passa, we ALREADY have a community project. It is called sauerbraten. I am not sure what you people are all confused about. Like Makke said, if you want to make maps, JUST MAKE THEM, and if they have quality they will get added to sauerbraten, the game.

There will always be people that will judge a game instantly like "its lame look at the ogro" or whatever. Sauer is never going to look as good as the latest and greatest commercial FPS (not until I get 20 fulltime artists or so). So there is absolutely no point in trying to cater for these short attention span people.

If people can't unzip and click a .bat (I will even switch to an installer once it gets more mature), then that is their own problem. I am not trying to make money here so there is no point in trying to win over the "can only click on shiny buttons" crowd. There will be no frontend.

Most people assume that the only purpose of any project is maximum exposure. It is not. I am more interested in great gamedesign, great content, and great code.

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#21: Re: ..

by MitaMAN in the cave on 02/19/2006 01:35, refers to #12

Perhaps post SAUER on gamehippo.com, devmaster.com, and moddb.com to name a few. Gamehippo and DevMaster is where I first found out about CUBE.

Aard, I must admit I'm sorry you "decided to cancel a mod friendly scripting engine for sauer". I was looking forward to seeing what I could come up with in single player maps for Sauer.

But still much can be done with some imagination using triggers/moving models (I hope that may still be planned).

Even as the engine stands right now it's great to work with, it can only get better.

I must get off my lazy butt and finish my first Sauer SP map.

MitaMAN

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#22: Re: game design document

by Aardappel_ on 02/19/2006 01:40, refers to #15

I have a summarized game design document for the RPG. And trust me, you will all get to see it and have a chance to suggest changes etc.

But I want to do things in order. Right now, the first priority is polishing off the FPS DM gameplay, and we're getting close. Next up will be the FPS SP gameplay. At some point I will declare the FPS "mostly done" and from there on it will only get minor tweaks.

Then the gameplay code will get forked, and a seperate RPG game will be started. We already have some great maps in the making, and other content production can start already.

Yes, the main theme will be medieval/fantasy. That is not because I think its such a great theme, it is rather unoriginal. It is only because art is hard to come by, and this theme will be the easiest for art.

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#23: Re: ..

by Aardappel_ on 02/19/2006 01:46, refers to #13

drian, I am not sure I will continue the wiki, it has been a complete disaster from an administration pov, and contribution hasn't been great either.

I hope instead to find people that want to work on documentation that simply is part of the distribution.

The docs already explain that the source is OS and the media is not. I am not sure why all these people would read the wiki if they don't read the docs. I will work on stating it even more clearly... but I don't feel I can do more short of placing big things in exclamation marks at the top of sauerbraten.org. Even that gets skipped (quite a lot of people have downloaded/played cube without ever seeing cubeengine.com, thru all these "free game" download sites).

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#24: Re: ..

by Aardappel_ on 02/19/2006 01:58, refers to #21

mitaman, the language I was planning was meant for implementing the entire gameplay code, i.e. a replacement for about a quarter of all C++ code (see src/fps/). Level scripting is a different thing altogether, and will still be possible thru the current mini scripting language that is already in sauer. There will be triggers and doors, eventually.

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#25: Re: ..

by Passa on 02/19/2006 11:56, refers to #24

fair enough.
i did sorta get carried away abit ;)

so back to the community project. are you talking like a similar thing to the unreal tournament 2004/2003 CBP things?

btw, ive noticed that pretty much everyone that is a cube regular plays either UT or quake and in most cases both. whats with that?

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#26: Re: ..

by >driAn<. on 02/19/2006 12:23, refers to #23

> drian, I am not sure I will continue the wiki, it has been a complete disaster from an administration pov, and contribution hasn't been great either.

Thats sad :(
I tried to add some lines on md3 usage when I saw it was still read-only. I see the spam is a big probem, but I think a wiki is somehow still the most convenient way for a community to create documentation, even if registration would be required.
Yes, contribution hasn't been great, but maybe we set a wrong basis for the wiki. I assume contribution would have been better, if we had imported the current doc's (editref, *_readmes, etc) at first to make a basis where people can easily add and update content. Maybe link from the ref commands to howtos that explain its usage better, etc.
The idea of putting posts from the forum into the wiki wasn't bad though. Maybe a more powerful wiki software would help on the administrative side.

Just some thoughts..

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#27: Re: ..

by >driAn<. on 02/19/2006 12:25, refers to #24

Btw, if found the useful command 'listlen' in cube, its not in the editref though.

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#28: crap

by kurtis84 on 02/19/2006 19:05, refers to #20

All I have to say about this kind of thing is, WHY?!?

Sauerbraten ALREADY has every single thing mentioned here...wtf people, read the docs, and keep up to date with the engine changes for this game. Maybe try dropping in on the IRC channel, and talk to the people that work on this thing already...I'm sure theres a place for you here, as long as you can do more than talk about work.

Sauerbraten has been stable for a long time now, MP has been working for a long time, and the master server has recently been added as well!

Contribute if you want to build a map, model, or textures...don't take the engine and make a "new game", as it's not your engine to do so...show some respect for the REAL workers, the guys that sit and code for years. I wish people would realise the difference between making a game, and making a mod.

BTW..."game maker" programs are all over the net. These programs already have an engine in place, as well as a good start on resources. In my opinion, this is not "creating a game", it's just making maps and/or resources for something already built. I can see how morons would mistake sauerbraten or cube for such a program...if they didn't read any docs, or didn't yet play the game.

ALSO, cube and sauer already have a front end...it's called a .bat, and IMHO, if you are too dumb to use that, you definately should stick to commercial games that install a nice shortcut on your desktop/start menu for you.

I could keep going, but I don't want to seem like too much of an asshole...so I'll shut up now :)

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#29: Re: crap

by Passa on 02/19/2006 21:39, refers to #28

dude this has already been discussed. relax man.

btw if you create completely new content you can use the source code of sauerbraten with no problems. but that (as i have now realised) is not what this is.

do you remember the community bonus packs for unreal tournament 2004? thats what this is. (am i right this time?)

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#30: Re: ..

by Aardappel_ on 02/19/2006 22:28, refers to #26

drian, you have CVS access, so if you see documentation issues, please fix them :)

the whole reason I took such a simple wiki is that most CMSes are terribly complicated. I don't want to have to deal with that.

Yes I agree a wiki could be great for documentation. Every time I type an explanation of something here in the forums I feel it is wasted because it will slip away.

I will give it some thought.

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#31: Re: crap

by Aardappel_ on 02/19/2006 22:31, refers to #29

no, you're not. I am not going to repeat myself. read my (and Makke's, kurtis') posts.

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#32: Re: ..

by Passa on 02/20/2006 09:11, refers to #30

i rekon scrap the wiki. people should post tutorials here, and then if they are helpful enough they should be added to the cube/sauerbraten docs. also there should be a documentation.html or something file in the main sauerbraten folder so that is is obvious as most new players simply open the .bat and start playing.

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