Cube Legends

by tentus on 03/27/2005 05:45, 199 messages, last message: 04/29/2007 19:50, 131570 views, last view: 04/26/2024 03:00

This thread exists for discussion of my MOD, Cube Legends. This block of text introducing it is nonspecific so I'm not stuck with outdated or blatantly wrong information at the top of the thread.

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#181: Re: ..

by shadow,516 on 04/05/2006 23:20, refers to #180

Shit, now look what this has turned into. I've been just trying to ignore this until it goes away. Unfortunately, it seems to be turning into a civil war.

Don't get me wrong, I think that authors should get the final decision about what happens to their stuff.

I just think this has gone way too far, and it's spliting the community in half.

I'm not taking an official stance, I just want things to be the way they USED to be...

Oh, and major props to tentus for making one hell of a mod - I'll be sad to see it go.

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#182: Re: ..sorry to see you go (I mean that)

by MitaMAN in the cave on 04/05/2006 23:43, refers to #180

What the hell has happened here to what I once considered a fine online community? (and I have been here a long time)

So much finger pointing and anger, people accused of theft, over what? It's just a freeware game!! This was supposed to be fun!! You make something, I make something, we make something, smoosh it together into a map/mod/stand-alone (whatever the hell it's called) and have FUN AND LEARN FROM EACH OTHER!!!!

Is anyone making money here or even trying to make money? I'm pretty sure no one here (I'm taking about the regulars in CUBE/SAUER) has used any other persons stuff and claimed it as there own. What is the big deal if someone uses someone elses model, or texture, or piece of code. I thought this was an "open community" willing to share with each other.

I'm sure many of you think I'm wrong in my opinion, that I'm some as**ole looking to take advantage of someone elses content. And I still don't understand why you gave WASDA (and many others) such a hard time.

You guys take this stuff way too serious. There are far more important things in life to be concerned about. A modified texture or model skin doesn't mean sh*t in the big picture of life.

Sorry to say this, but I think too many of you are too full of yourself's and and the perceived importance of these freeware games. You have forgotten that this was supposed to be fun.

In ending my ranting I just want to say: "I believe in giving full credit to the original content creator in a readme file, it's the right thing to do".

If so many of you are that worried about others modifying stuff you created, DRAFT UP BETTER README DOCS!

Now you guys can flame me / ban me / whatever - I am truly ashamed of most of you - people I onced thought of as friends.

MitaMAN

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#183: Re: ..sorry to see you go (I mean that)

by >driAn<. on 04/06/2006 00:47, refers to #182

Ok, some bad stuff was going on lately. We have different opinions about the copyright issue and we all overreacted. Let's calm down and try to solve that problem. Tentus, don't give up, give the community one more chance to work together. Aard, please don't do a quick decision about the source. Lets calm down and think clearly about the situation.

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#184: ..

by makkE on 04/06/2006 01:24

I see this has gone way to far.
Sad to see it puts you off so much, tentus and mitaman.

What started as a discussion of some few individuals simply not caring about any credits/docs/rights has envolved into something that has to stop. What started as "how can the shopping attitude of some peoplebe stopped" has turned into far too much anger and some people sort of jumping in on one of the "sides" just to be able to unleash a nasty un-appealing comment hasn´t made the situation any better, while I do not want to free my self from being influenced by group dynamics.. I´m only human too.

In the past, what mods were there? Quad, DI, CL.. and a few smaller ones.
Now most of these people actually had contributed a lot before or while doing that to the official packages in terms of cool maps, or they altered their mods to a point where they were actually a lot diffrent from the original, or added a lot of cool features. The whole disgust came with stuff like sopo, wich cmon.. was pretty lame.

I do see I have overreacted myself a little too, maybe, and I certainly do agree with you that it´s nothing in the big picture.

All I was concerned about is people should ask me if they can use my stuff, nothing more.
If I see some promising fun stuff comming up I´ll be the last to deny to donate some of my stuff where I see it appropriate. I even found time to donate here and there a little besides my own projects. I simply don´t like to see someone whipping a quick filter over my stuff without asking.

It was never my intention to disparage standalone mods, quite the opposite, I do welcome that, especially if there´s so much devotion there as in your case tentus.
And seeing the amount of stuff you already did replace, I don´t think there´s much to be questioned left anyways.

The problem by now is simply to have clear guidelines towards content so everyone plays by the same rules.

The more I think about it, the more I start to understand the "other fraction" as well, I have to admit.

Maybe my opinion was a little pre-occupied because the only two mods I´m involved in are either small
add-on (pcube) or TC with about 75% of the content created by me, and the rest from free sources (that one is to be TBA, but I spend 2 years on that)

There are just some facts about the package issue that can´t be denied:

1. The exsisting readme´s often won´t let you assume that you were´nt allowed to repackage the stuff in a standalone.
The exsisting readme´s often don´t have a valid email adress,since most of the stuff is already 6-8 years old.

2.When they are missing, it becomes obviously hard to find out the author (if you realize that no readme != no restrictions in the first place).

So there is , although I do not agree with the way of presentation, some truth to wasda asking for clarification.

And in the end, even if the readme´s were all clear and authors reachable, I don´t think those contributors not related directly to cube would oppose to give permission. (and probably most of those who are, too)
So if that was the case, and every modder got his permissions, many mods will probably still not differ too much from the official package. (at least concerning the textures).

The whole discussion is imho not so much about the content itself (as I tried to get across above) but about respecting the interlectual property of others.

There is one possible solution maybe:
Make a "mod" package besides the game package that will only contain dummy content and a free charset, no docs exept the vital notes, and possibly a readme file that clarifies the need to ask for permissions to the content where required, etc.

This might not help real theft, but could at least help to bring attention to the nature of copyright, wich I agree has bad but also good sides.

I assume Aard would probably not consider the effort reasonable, however I would be willing to set up and maintain such a package.

I will , as already stated include a list of all my files and their respective restrictions in the next sauerbraten release.
You are right mitaman in saying this is neccesairy, it just never was a big problem before, since everyone involved in modding used to know the other and know what they´d do or not.
Note that not all of my stuff has restrictions, there is just some stuff I rather like to see not to turn up in any mod, since I made it to support the official sauerbraten/cube in the first place. (such as my objects for the rpg, or the pistol, or the new gl skin).
I simply feel I want to give some of my stuff back to Aard exclusively, since he did these cool games for me.

About EDM : As much as I may disagree with wasda´s attitude, I still respect his efforts, since after all he knows how to code. I like that mod´s ideas.
And I don´t want to throw any stones into his way.

And wasda may count this as a written permission that I do grant the permission to use my fist and pistol, even to derive other models from that in case that hand might be usefull in holding other stuff.

And for the end of this rant, I want to add to what drian already said:
Please lets all calm down (I´ll too) and try to find a reasonable solution, for the sake of this fine engines and the community, wich I´d really hate to see fall apart. And please those who don´t have anything constructive to say but stuff amongst the lines of "now youre some asshole" please refrain from that, it only makes it worse.

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#185: Re: ..

by shadow,516 on 04/06/2006 02:46, refers to #184

Amen

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#186: Re: ..

by Aardappel_ on 04/06/2006 05:37, refers to #184

argh. This is exactly what I didn't want, for all the legit people to have to get upset. Ah well. Do what you have to do.

If you all think I am evil for taking coprights and lefts seriously, I am afraid I will continue to do so. You simply can't run projects like this without it. I don't understand the attitude of the "ah, who cares, just copy whatever", it is very unprofessional.

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#187: FYI

by Aardappel_ on 04/06/2006 05:51

you can get angry at me for closing down 2 threads which became nothing but flaming. Lets keep this one clean, thanks.

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#188: ..

by pushplay on 04/06/2006 07:43

And the award for longest post ever goes to...

The thread has clearly become a little too serious for its own good. So in that spirit I present my favorite awful joke:

What do you call a fish with no eyes?

A fsh! Ba dum ching. Thank you and remember to tip your waitress.

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#189: Re: ..

by Sparr on 04/06/2006 07:50, refers to #188

What do you call a fly with no wings?

...

A walk.

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#190: ..

by makkE on 04/06/2006 19:06

The mg-style chaingun is made by dcp.
The darthvim models. I have enhanced the skins a little before the last cube update I think.

I had tried to contact Darthvim, and though I found traces of him in a dead doom3 forum and on other places, none of the email, pming and msn and other im´s have been succesful.

But since he says:
Copyrihgt info: "Please ask me bevore you want to change things on it and send me you weapon (so that i can have a look on it :=)"
, and I improved them while keeping the general design direction and made them to stay with the official cube, I assumed I was at least acting in accordance to his will. (I hope)
Still, the copyright is with him therefore.
Unfortunately this is a very grey area. Darthvim was stating the hands on the models were´nt actually made by him, I suspect they have been taken from a q2 addon model.

About models/makke see that credits file.

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#191: ..

by makkE on 04/06/2006 20:32

http://www.cubeengine.com/forum.php4?action=display_thread&thread_id=822

that one.

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#194: Cube Legends Archive Edition

by tentus_ on 04/26/2007 01:18

Cube Legends Archive Edition can be found at http://www.quadropolis.us/node/580

Well, it would be found there, if I could get it uploaded. Suggestions for making it work? the zip is only 20.2 mb in size, should I split it apart?

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#195: Re: Cube Legends Archive Edition

by Quin on 04/26/2007 06:04, refers to #194

Quad is being weird, you could either host it elsewhere and make the download link an xhtml page that redirects, or get someone else to do that for you.

I could probably host it on SauerMod's sourceforge project if you cbf setting one up for yourself. I'm intrigued by the idea of Cube Legends myself, and may end up porting it to SauerMod seeing as you don't seem to be worried what happens with this.

This is mostly for the medieval style MP everyone seems to love. RPG SP is left to the realm of Eisenstern, and I'd hate to be writing things twice for each.

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#196: ..

by tentus_ on 04/26/2007 07:13

Hm. I haven't got the space for a 20 meg file on my own host, and I don't have the time to set up a server of my own right now (exams time, whee!).

Do you want me to email the file to you, Quin?

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#197: Message censored by administrator

by Burnys(REAL!) on 04/26/2007 09:40

#198: Re: ..

by Quin on 04/26/2007 10:50, refers to #196

Go for it, glad to be of assistance to the community :)

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#199: Thank you, Quin

by tentus_ on 04/27/2007 09:54

Quin was good enough to stick the Archive Edition alongside the Sauermod project on SourceForge. Thank you, Quin.

http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=191686&package_id=230081&release_id=504088

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#200: Chnage in leadership.

by tentus_ on 04/28/2007 05:42

Will wonders never cease, I have been talking with Sauerplayer recently through email and he has decided he wants to pick up the Cube Legends project where it left off. He's got my full permission to do what he will with the project, and I hope to see some fun results from his promising work!

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#201: ..

by Drakas on 04/28/2007 09:34

I tried to play it yesterday, and there is no source, just a windows binary. I'm in Debian GNU/Linux so I had to use Wine. The gameplay therefore was no good :[

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#202: ..

by theButcher on 04/29/2007 19:50

Wow. This mod was amazingly fun.

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