first commercial sauerbraten licensee...

by Aardappel_ on 05/26/2006 20:23, 34 messages, last message: 05/29/2006 19:50, 9117 views, last view: 04/29/2024 11:16

is proper games. Check out their website:

http://www.proper-games.com/technology.html

I was able to see their E3 demo, and it is really cool what they managed to do with the engine.

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#7: ..

by Stakhanov on 05/27/2006 01:16

It is heart-warming and worrying at the same time... they have gone quite far already , and changed Cube into a real beauty , but what prevents them from copyrighting every single breakthrough ? Cube's open source license couldn't fight back , so the future of free Cube games is in jeopardy. It would have been a safer (albeit harsher) choice to use the GPL...

I for one , do not welcome a commercial game exploiting the Cube engine... call me prejudiced , but I do not like the idea of seeing the coder's generosity squandered for a short-lived seller. The worst scenario , though , is that the Cube engine is enslaved to serve an ever-growing commercial RPG , putting World of Warcraft's profitability to shame.

Is it legally too late to prevent such things from happening ?

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#8: Re: ..

by Passa on 05/27/2006 01:20, refers to #6

Hell, it seems Aardappel can implement pretty much anything into Sauerbraten.

I guess looking at it from your perspective makkE, it doesn't seem bad. The promotion of the Sauerbraten engine will mean more people to the site, and a chance to get more content etc.

The intresting thing is, is that the other day I thought about posting in the General thread, an idea for a commercial Sauerbraten game, to promote it lol.

C:uber... sounds german, and similar to UberSoldier.. is it being released worldwide? And there are not any details on release date or exactly what sort of game it is..

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#9: Re: ..

by Passa on 05/27/2006 01:21, refers to #7

Not Cube, Sauerbraten. And I don't understand your post :/

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#10: ..

by Stakhanov on 05/27/2006 01:36

woops... pardon my literary style :>

I meant I'm worried to see a game company expand the Cube engine , since they could use the copyright law to halt the growth of similar but free Cube games , and make room for their own commercial product.

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#11: Re: ..

by eihrul on 05/27/2006 02:21, refers to #10

No, they can't. Your understanding of copyright law is incorrect.

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#12: Re: ..

by Passa on 05/27/2006 06:12, refers to #11

Since its based on Sauerbraten, does this mean that technically they have to release the source code to the game?

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#13: Re: ..

by jendave on 05/27/2006 07:35, refers to #12

No. They don't have to release the code since Sauerbraten is released under the zlib license. Unlike the GPL or the LGPL, the zlib license (like the BSD or MIT licenses) does not require releasing code changes.

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#14: Closed Source Forks

by pushplay on 05/27/2006 08:26

There aren't a limited number of Sauer forks. The creation of this game in no way diminishes what we can do, there's just one more commercial game out there now. So good on them.

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#15: Re: ..

by Aardappel_ on 05/27/2006 10:43, refers to #7

There's nothing to worry about with this game. It doesn't limit us, it just shows that what we're doing has some serious value. The guys doing this game project have been in contact with me all along, and I have encouraged them.

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#16: Re: ..

by rancor on 05/27/2006 10:57, refers to #15

Out of curiosity, what was the motivation for porting to DX, and how much effort did that entail?

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#17: Re: ..

by CC_machine0 on 05/27/2006 11:34, refers to #16

yeh, sounds quite stupid to me, why didnt they keep the OpenGL code and have it as an option in the menus to switch between d3d and OpenGL?

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#18: Re: Direct X and OpenGL

by cronos on 05/27/2006 11:43, refers to #17

The reasons for the use of Direct X are requirements of some of the target platforms and OpenGL is still optional.

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#19: Re: OpenGL Multitexture

by kurtis84 on 05/27/2006 19:01, refers to #19

"Do you need to leave the OpenGL spec to support more than 2 multitextures?"

afaik, there is nothing in DirectX that openGL cannot do. The choice to make a game DX specific might piss off the linux and mac users...but like it or not, linux and mac are a minority. The commercial gaming industry is going for money by following the mainstream OS, which is without dispute, windows.

Just for the record, I would switch to linux in a heartbeat...I hate windows. BUT, I'm a gamer, so I run the OS that supports the most games.

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#20: Re: OpenGL Multitexture

by eihrul on 05/27/2006 19:59, refers to #19

Believe it or not, there are *cough* certain platforms *cough* on which OpenGL is not supported, and which only DirectX is available.

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#21: ..

by Stakhanov on 05/27/2006 20:01

"In fact, you can look at it as a future opportunity to be paid for the work you do now for free."

Grrr...

Isn't it obvious ? Commercial games do not follow the gamer's interests , the post above highlights that only open source is guaranteed to work on linux and mac. Commercial games are by definition designed to sell , not entertain the player for years... since the owning company usually won't take long to release a new generation of similar games.

Why is it that people consider only commercial games to be serious ? Amateur content has surpassed retail material in every single FPS in existence. If Cube could directly use mods from Half-Life for example , everyone would play it...

As philosophical as it may seem , to me it is a very serious issue : the growth of open source games may have political ramifications. Freedom is worth coding for.

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#22: Re: ..

by eihrul on 05/27/2006 20:05, refers to #21

Umm, you are confusing two ideas as opposites for no actual reason - "commercial" and "open source". One has nothing to do with the other. You can have commercial open-source, and non-commercial closed source.

You're basically coming off as whining that you have to pay for content. Boo-hoo.

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#23: ..

by sinsky on 05/28/2006 00:32

I don't think there are any issues considering licensing that need discussion, not in this case. Moreover, Aard and probably the rest of the Sauer developers have seen a demo and are positive about it. Cube and Sauer influence on the industry - now that's a more philosophical subject, if I can find at least one philosopher, we can give it a go :)

It's interesting to think about how user-friendly world editing could change gaming. Generally, it's all about editing - when you shoot stuff and toggle switches, you kinda edit the level.. Even with adventure games, which are considered the simplest kind of game possible, a gamer needs to change stuff in order to see what happens next. However, trying to make people edit a world more than they want to (which is more fun, no doubt) is not what you could call a winning market strategy. My idea of a regular customer is a guy who comes tired of work (or whatever else you can think of), and plays a PC (or whatever) game to relax and distract. Problems associated with creating new levels, even in the simplest way possible, are the last thing the guy would need.

Still, it's my firm belief powerful editing features should be used in every way possible to impress "regular customers" as well. Who knows, maybe one day we'll get the ideal customer - enters the local store, buys a fresh engine, makes a game (while having lunch), and plays with friends in the evening :)

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#24: ..

by pushplay on 05/28/2006 01:38

> Amateur content has surpassed retail material in every single FPS in existence.

Only the best of it. 95% of amature content undershoots retail quality.

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#25: Re: ..

by Passa on 05/28/2006 01:46, refers to #23

I've had the idea before of an editing mode in Sauerbraten that actually FOCUSES on gameplay. As in, you can edit the level with a decreased level of control, with limited amounts of scrolls whatever which are limited by the amount of 'edit' pickups you get. Imagine editing the map around you to suit your battleplan, or jumping off a ledge accidentaly and quickly building a platform to save you. How awesome would that be :)

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#26: Re: ..

by rancor on 05/28/2006 03:08, refers to #25

That would be sort of cool. You'd have to set it up so that you couldn't just drop a lot of ammo around. Maybe have pickups that gave add/delete so many cubic units.

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