Suggestions for Cube 2 : Sauerbraten

by wanderer on 05/16/2017 22:41, 9 messages, last message: 06/07/2017 12:02, 2516 views, last view: 04/25/2024 01:09

Hello everyone. I have known sauerbraten since july 2008 so that’s almost 9 years. I have been playing under various nicknames : first younes then nature and now wanderer (my auth nickname is « naturepalace »). To me sauerbraten is an excellent game with a very unique feel. Over the years I have been picking up issues and I feel like I can make suggestions for those issues. I know there's already a topic for making suggestions but I really wanted to have my own. Here are my suggestions in a random order :

•Add a frag sound. Sometimes when you fire rockets or grenades you don’t get to see your opponent fragged, you have to lift your eyes to the console as it’s where it gets output (you fragged playername). With a fragsound you could have the information whilst keeping your eyes on the action at play.

•Add an optional sound feature that would pitch the hit sound depending on the damage dealt with grenades, rockets and the shotgun. The more damage dealt, the more low pitched the hit sound his. Conversely, the less damage dealt, the less low pitched the hit sound is. For direct hits with grenades and rockets, the hit sound would need to be significantly more low pitched (or even different). This way you would be able to know if it was a direct hit when you don’t get to see the projectile hit your opponent.

•Fix the weapon switch sound. If I strafe left as I change weapon, I will hear the weapon switch sound coming from my right. Conversely, If I strafe right as I change weapon, I will hear the weapon switch sound coming from my left. The sound of your own weapon switchs should remain the same in all circumstances : monaural (just like the sound of your own jumps).

•Remove sp and rpg content (or make it downloadable as additional content). Removing these would make the game lighter to download.

•Ask Nieb to stop making maps with the overall shape of a pan. Tell him to take a piece of paper and pen and to come up with some layout.

•Remove some maps. The way I see it, too much maps were added to the previous release. We all inherently know that quality matters more than quantity. Removing the game’s worst and most unplayed maps would raise the average quality of Sauerbraten maps. Here is list of maps that I believe could be removed : akaritori, alloy, aqueducts, asgard, donya, duel7, dune, europium, evilness, force, frostbyte, guacamole, island, katrez_d, kmap5, mach2, masdm, orion, pitch_black, roughinery, sauerstruck, shindou, shiva, snapper_rocks, sacrifice, spcr, subterra, tortuga, stemple, thor, torment, valhalla, xenon. In addition to removing some maps I believe the requirements for a map to make it into the release should be raised. Right now sauerbraten needs maps that show some thoughtful layout (like reissen or dust2). There’s no need anymore for « pan » maps or symetrical maps with face-to-face bases.

•Add the ability to either choose, allow or force player models for you, your teamates and your opponents. Currently, you can only choose a player models for yourself and allow other’s player models or force them to match yours. Basicly just add some menu with player models tickable for your teamates and your opponents which would allow specific player models or not for your teamates and your opponents.

•Make edit mode accessible with ctrl+e not just e. That would allow for the e key to be an additional bind (for weapons or anything else).

•Make the chainsaw hit continuously and recharge only after a hit. If you do so, remove it from insta modes.

•Reduce self-inflicted damage with rockets. I feel that we die too much in this game because of self-inflicted damage with rockets. Besides, it doesn’t make sense that you get more damage with rockets than with grenade considering rocket jumps won’t get you higher than grenade jumps. I believe self-inflicted damage with rockets should be halved.

•Bring in all the features from the Comed client. The features added by the Comed client are the features the community expect and really want so no questionning on them :p

•Remove protect and collect modes. They're similar and people really don't care about them and never have (rightfully so...).

•There is a command for extending the sound limit distance after which you cannot hear. I can’t remember that command but the sound limit distance should be hardcoded and impossible to modify. It’s bullshit that one can hear its opponent at the other end of a map especially in ffa.

•Make the bots less stupid. Right now the bots are only waypoints and aimbot based. Sometimes they will back away from rocket and grenade fire at exit turns. Bots should also know about item timing and control, positionning, weapon use cases, weapon combos, priorities, flag retrievals…etc. Give bots names instead of that « bot 128 » and have their names highlighted in a specific color.

•Ban all those servers with gameplay mods (racing, rugby, zombie...etc). Sauerbraten is being taken over by those worthless nooby mods. Sauerbraten is an ARENA FPS. If people want to race they should download a racing game. If they they want to play a zombie mode they should check a game with zombies. Rugby defeats the purpose of maps' layouts and flagrunning gameplay. Saurbraten gameplay should be finely tuned and locked down not taken over by noobs and their petty desires for gameplay modding, new weapons...etc. There was a time when you would always have a regen capture server. Now it's all about those braindead gameplay mods and instateam venice. This is what you get for empowering noobs...

•Specific sounds for each player model. I know there’s only one set of sounds for all player models but at least make it a softcodable possibility (within sounds.cfg for example).

•Different weapon flare colors for your teamates and your opponents.

•How about in-water sounds and particles (bubbles) ? If I’m correct it was Q009 who did it for his sauerenhanced client. I have always found it unelegant for sauerbraten to not have in-water sounds and in-water particles (bubbles).

•I don’t know if it is technically possible but a feature to add transparency to hudguns would be welcome.

•How about sauerbraten on steam ?

•Quad and HB are clearly overpowered and I know I'm not the only one saying it. I think this could be addressed throughout three elementss : first a duel mode that would make powerups unavailable (and additionally spawns to happen out of your opponent's sight). Second the quad should be droppable once killed and pickable by your opponents once dropped. I believe the quad could be held no more than 20 seconds by one player but could last a total duration of 30 seconds from hand to hand. Last but not least, HB should work for 5 minutes maybe not all throughout the game. Maybe HB should be replaced with a decreasing megahealth like in Cube 1.

•The YA advantage is too big. Maybe it should absorb two thirds of the damages not three fourths.

•If I had to pick the most annoying thing in this game, it would be that thing you have rotating on your screen once you enter an explosion. Remove it. Talking about explosions, explosions should be soft and small like in quake 3 not big, loud, annoying and possible to disable like in sauerbraten !...

•Make the addition of player models possible without any hardcode modifications. I don’t know if that’s technically possible (but it’s still on my wishlist :p).

Thanks in advance for any consideration/repply.

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#1: ..

by chasester on 05/17/2017 05:33

@1 its already there under the game menu in the options named hit sound. Plus you get a change in your crosshair when you hit something :)

@2 That sounds annoying tbh, but I guess it would be easy to add.

@3 Im sure this is due to the poor sound overall and not just one small error

@4 I guess its already super light and most the stuff from rpg and sp stuff is in one of the many main maps. I dont think this would really cut out as much as you think it would.

@5 well maybe you should make a map and post it on one of the various sites that exist for said content. Hes made a good portion of the assets and maps for the game so I dont know what you plan to accomplish by raging out one person. but ok?

@6 Again I dont see the point of this, but you could just delete them on your system if you dont like that map, which would stop you from ever having to play on these, "poorly" design maps.

@7 Im confussed, do you want different player models for your team compared to your enemies? If so again an easy fix but I dont see the point. The bounding boxes are the same on all the models so the actual visuals is all client side, so you could just edit the source so you could have this like you want it?

@8 you can change this in script, so just do that :)

@9 ... ya thats not gonna happen :) mostly cuz of the way the hit system works.. i would go into detail but I dont think you would understand.

@10 some servers do this, by disallowing team damage. Some people would say you lack the skill of aim if you keep killing your self from a projectile that should be shot from a distance. :) But Im more in the no team killing camp.

@11 odd ive been playing longer than you and never heard of commet client. I feel that maybe your niche group may want them but I dont know if that constitutes every one. But I doubt sauer will see very many new features added

@12 I feel collect mode will have the same fate as assassin mode. But Protect is interesting to an extent.

@13 Sounds like you are mad cuz you keep losing? Maybe if sauer was a more hard core game this would be a thing, but I dont see this ever happening :)

@14 The code is open source :) have at it. Im sure you will find its much more complex then you realized.

@15 I feel like this was on the table at one point but I dont think it happen cuz of the out rage :)

@16 Again its open source :)

@17 And you guessed it, the game is open source :) have fun

@18 Open source ?

@19 mhmm open source well actually that one i can explain in like 10 seconds, there is a function in rendergl called renderavatar() and there the hud gun is rendered, when calling rendermodel() one of the pass ins is alpha :) so if you just change that you get see through guns

@20 meh sauer is mostly dead, or less alive then it was, it wouldnt be allowed on steam, and other sauer mods have been on green light with no real luck.

@21 Ive heard arguments on both sides, this game design forces a particular style of game play that isnt nessarly bad but I would agree with a change but some hard core fans would be very opposied

@22 ^^

@23 source is open you could just change it or do what you want with it :)

@24 LOL not to bash some one, but the code is not written that well, it would be a struggle :)

chasester

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#2: ..

by wanderer on 05/17/2017 09:37

Lol nice work at bringing down the yet sincere suggestions that I was making chasester.

@1 I think you didn't get me. I'm talking about a frag sound not a hit sound. A sound for when you kill an opponent in addition to the hit sound which is a sound for when you hit an opponent. Sauerbraten has no frag sound.

@2 This is not annoying. This is what quake live already has.

@6 The matter is the average quality of sauerbraten maps. Sauerbraten needs to have it's worst maps removed to raise that. Removing those maps from my system won't change the fact that they will still be played on servers...

@7 What I was envisionning is a menu in which you would allow for yourself to see one or more player models for your teammates and the same for your opponents.

@10 I do not lack the skill of aim, I can show you if you want...Anyway maybe teamkill damage should be removed

@11 http://comed.sauerworld.org/
This is no niche

@13 I do not keep losing, actually the opposite. It should happen regardless...

@15 It should happen regardless of the out rage. This is the game that is at stake

@16 @17 Because it's open source doesn't mean it shouldn't be reviewed for a greater audience and happen just for myself.

@18 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRmffje5WsM
http://www.moddb.com/mods/sauerenhanced/downloads
I don't think it works with this game's current version though

@21 This is not the style of gameplay I'm talking about, it's the balance. I'm sure most hardcore fans would welcome such changes. Besides it would make this game less dumb on the edges.

@22 It should really be changed to two thirds not three fourths

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#3: More suggestions for other people to do

by star on 05/17/2017 23:09

Hi,

@I have also more suggestions for other people to make.

@II don't make I just suggest stuff I'd like to have

@3 How about Grappling hooks? Huh? Wouldn't that be awesome hanging out under the map Reissen?

@IV How about Jetpacks? lets face it, all of the pro players, already fly anyway! Now noobs can, too!

@I5 How about Unicorns? I love horses.

@5IX A Zapper to electrocute every idiot who starts this suggestion topics in the future.

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#4: ..

by chasester on 05/17/2017 23:34

@star
All your ideas are gold

@wanderer

not meaning to undermine you but There are always plenty of "good" ideas, its doing them thats hard. But thanx for sharing :)

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#5: Re: ..

by 'eS|tipsy on 05/22/2017 19:32, refers to #4

Wanderer, some of these are good suggestions. I think what we need to realize though is that Sauer will NEVER see gameplay changes to this extent. Eihrul is not interested in developing the gameplay of Sauerbraten. There have been only two minor changes (pistol damage and nade range/reload/damage) in the past decade. We either have to live with what we have, or do something on our own.

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#6: ..

by Zamwa on 05/24/2017 06:41

I like screams,pans,vanity, selfyd,protect,AI,auto names,(servers racing, rugby, zombie...etc),SauerEnhanced,SourceForge,yellow armor,akaritori, alloy, aqueducts, asgard, donya, duel7, dune, europium, evilness, force, frostbyte, guacamole, island, katrez_d, kmap5, mach2, masdm, orion, pitch_black, roughinery, sauerstruck, shindou, shiva, snapper_rocks, sacrifice, spcr, subterra, tortuga, stemple, thor, torment, valhalla, xenon!

Transmitted quad cooties cool! ;")

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#7: ..

by suicizer03 on 06/06/2017 12:19

I would encourage all sound- and playermodel-related suggetions given by Younes (hey matey :D!). Except bring able to add playermodels on an easier way.

Some maps and modes certainly should be dropped.

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#8: ..

by suicizer03 on 06/07/2017 00:14

•Ask Nieb to stop making maps with the overall shape of a pan.
•Remove some maps.

This sounds contradicting. Some maps you're mentioning are exactly not like a shape of a pan. Although I agree some maps should leave the scene, but there are certain which could be modified to become better. There are even maps which just work fine, but they aren't just so popular to the public.

•Ban all those servers with gameplay mods...

Agreeing. If I want to play Sauerbraten, then I want to play Sauerbraten. Not some gimmick mod.

•If I had to pick the most annoying thing in this game...
You mean the actual explosion-particle? I don't see anything else like what you've described. Just ignore it. There once were way worse things to bother about when being hit (like your screen being shaked).

Next time, number your suggestions. It's pretty annoying like this to react.

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#9: ..

by suicizer03 on 06/07/2017 12:02

•Make the chainsaw hit continuously..

Chasester has a point here, but it goes further than that. Remember back in the day Ogro ruled the playground? It would be pretty awkward being able to hit continuesly with just a fist (and after ironsnout joined, a fist with a sawblade).

The YA truly is overpowered, same doe other powerups.

I loved the water-feature from SauerEnhanced. Was one of the best things about it.

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