How many people still play WITHOUT shaders?

by eihrul on 04/09/2015 18:23, 49 messages, last message: 10/07/2022 14:09, 31331 views, last view: 05/02/2024 15:50

Poll: Do you still play with shaders disabled? If shaders were required to play, would you still be able to play?

Reason I ask:

So, one of the things I was thinking about for the next release is getting rid of all the other rendering modes in the engine EXCEPT for the GLSL shader path.

This would mean we could possibly use a bit more spectacular shader effects as well since we wouldn't need to make sure it was supported on old GPUs.

The disadvantage is that people who are playing on older chipsets that do not support OpenGL 3.0 or at least OpenGL 2.1 would no longer be able to play.

It would also make the codebase a lot cleaner and easier to understand.

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#21: Re: ..

by swatllama on 05/03/2015 02:57, refers to #17

"Implementing cheating devices into the vanilla Sauerbraten?"
Suicizer, how the hell are other clients a cheating device? Do you play Sauer besides edit mode? I almost never see you on, so please stop giving misguided input when you don't have context.


I like the idea of removing old hardware support if it'll make the game look better. That's one of the things that prevents sauer from holding new players. We should also update our shitty textures too...

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#22: ..

by suicizer03 on 05/03/2015 11:32

I've been playing steadily less Sauerbraten after being aware that it's almost a must these days to use mods that actually change the gameplay of Sauerbraten as you get provided a lot more information throughout the game then you normally would (so that part of skill is dropped).

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#23: Re: ..

by suicizer03 on 05/03/2015 11:33, refers to #21

Now let's get back to that shader situation shall we?

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#24: Re: ..

by Papriko on 05/03/2015 15:39, refers to #22

And that's the reason why other people play less and less sauer. On one hand, people get told "you want a new feature? you know how much code that is? do it yourself" yet when they actually do it themselves, they get yelled out by conservative dinosaurs like you, because it is just a "cheating device".

Either one way or the other, they always seem to do it wrong. That's why they say FUCK IT and leave.

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#25: Re: ..

by hypernova^ on 05/04/2015 04:24, refers to #24

++

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#26: Re: ..

by suicizer03 on 05/04/2015 06:44, refers to #24

So what's your opinion about the real topic instead?

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#27: Re: ..

by Papriko on 05/04/2015 16:00, refers to #26

As I have stated before, I am playing with shaders on high settings anyways, so I don't care about the old render path, yet would appreciate a simplified code base.

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#28: Re: ..

by Zamwa on 05/05/2015 07:02, refers to #24

It's funny you say that! I've striped away a lot of the default content, players, servers to make room for modified server code, textures, modded core code for testing, scripts! All of this to raise My adrenaline to cause an almost autonomic trigger finger reaction! Though that was a little over year ago I now work to pay the bills!

Point is your still playing Sauerbraten the way that game was made while some of us made are own private forked projects that We share only with a closed group of friends!
My modded server's haven't been anywhere on sauer master server list and My friends keep it that way as well! I have no sympathy for the game breakers outside our circle! Permanent ban them all I say!

Textures with shaders!

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#29: Re: ..

by raz on 05/13/2015 23:04, refers to #28

The fuck did i just read?

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#30: Re: ..

by Zamwa on 05/14/2015 21:00, refers to #29

I've learned enough about ethics and code to keep the modded cubeengine clients (although no client side cheat mods) from ever departing My servers!
I enjoy modding a cheat server as a hobby, as no one has access to My source code! :"3

100% party pooper safe!

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#31: Re: ..

by hypernova^ on 05/14/2015 23:03, refers to #30

lol I do exactly the same thing xD

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#32: Re: ..

by Flareblood on 05/19/2015 22:20, refers to #13

900FPS!!!??? How!!?? Just how!?

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#33: Re: ..

by raz on 05/21/2015 04:50, refers to #32

Probably newmap :P

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#34: Go for it

by a_teammate on 05/24/2015 13:31

Imo what really blows up the rendering stuff atm are the workarounds for pre-2006 hardware and the assembly paths.

Cutting out those would already simplify stuff a lot.
So remaining would be the normal glsl shader pipeline + the fixed function path.
We could call the fixed function path "performance mode" (+ simplify it if necessary) and leave it in soley so competitive players can still wank to their fps (although their hardware support shaders).

ofc it will look increasingly different (ugly) from the normal mode, but thats what sauerbratens pros like anyways.

Furthermore i dont think the ff pipe does need a lot of maintenance, does it?

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#35: Data!

by Gambit on 05/28/2015 10:23

As a data point from a casual player from 2007, my daily driver is still a 2007 integrated Intel laptop supporting OpenGL 2.1. So, I play with shaders, and would continue to be able to play if GLSL were forced.

To compare with another game: Minecraft, which has a greater market, has 4% of its millions of users supporting a max of OpenGL 1 as of early 2015 [1]. In 2012, that number was 9% [2]. If it follows half-life distribution, then in about 3 more years (2018), that percentage should go down to 2%. Of course, this is not representative of Sauerbraten, but it's an approximation from a more wide-spread game.

[1] https://twitter.com/dinnerbone/status/561101216353370113
[2] http://www.java-gaming.org/index.php?topic=26377.0

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#36: ..

by eihrul on 06/07/2015 14:16

Given the feedback so far, I think it makes most sense to just proceed with my idea and only keep the GLSL paths. Most everyone seems supportive of the change, and I think it is best for the longevity of the codebase.

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#37: ..

by johnyukon1 on 06/08/2015 02:24

With this change, is there a chance that Tesseract codebase (http://tesseract.gg/) can be merged with Cube 2 to include the new features that exists on it?

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#38: Re: ..

by eihrul on 06/08/2015 05:53, refers to #37

No.

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#39: Re: ..

by swatllama on 06/15/2015 20:50, refers to #36

Glad you're doing this. :)

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#40: ..

by Drarrhat on 06/28/2015 21:47

Is it possible to make any new graphical effects optional? Currently there are commands to disable most of the extra effects. I'd rather not get a worse framerate if it can be avoided.

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