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Universal Map Package Format Concept

by MovingTarget on 07/06/2008 20:12, 33 messages, last message: 09/25/2008 18:01, 15447 views, last view: 05/05/2024 14:03

I've been thinking lately about how exactly to solve the never-ending issue of incorrect map packaging over at Quadropolis.
I tried with a Python script I submitted, but it didn't turn out that well, and even if it did, how would the community two years from now find out it's there? Of course you could provide a link in the Packaging section, but who looks there?

Then it hit me: Why not have a file format that stores the map, textures, screenshot, models, and other stuff?
Someone who has made a map would run a command--let's say "packagemap"--and the engine would run some steps:

1) Engine checks that map file exists
2) Engine checks that map file has screenshot (if not, prompts user to take one?)
3) Engine checks cfg (if there is one) for textures, models, skyboxes, and sounds that aren't included in vanilla Sauerbraten and includes those in the file
4) Engine jams all the stuff into a file named MAPNAME.sauermap (?)

The user then does the usual steps to upload their map.
Another user downloads the map. They stick the map in the main Sauerbraten directory (or some other place) and starts the game up. Sauerbraten indexes wherever the map files are to be placed, finds the newly downloaded file, unpackages everything where it's supposed to go, and the user can then play the map, with hardly any effort on his/her part at all.
And they lived happily ever after :D

In an even better scenario, the user that made the map, after running "packagemap", runs "uploadmap" and a GUI comes up with fields for all the required stuff (title, blurb, detailed description, etc.) He fills them in, presses OK and the engine uploads the map to Quadropolis (possibly through an interface meant to be used by Sauerbraten clients). The only thing I'm not sure about with this part is the username the map will be posted under. Maybe a username and password field too? Anyway, this interaction could be done with the help of libcURL.

The second user starts up Sauerbraten and clicks on the "Quadropolis" entry on the main menu. Sauerbraten quickly retrieves the latest maps (RSS feed?), parses what it gets, and shows the user a GUI with the ten or so most recent maps. He clicks on one, gets the detailed description and a download button. He downloads the map, the engine takes care of the unpackaging, and he's golden.


Now this is all just a concept I thought up, but I thought it an interesting enough concept to share with the community. Currently I'm not going to work on this until I get the plugin stuff done, if I work on it at all (hey, I might not need to if eihrul beats me to it :D).


If you like the concept, post why you like it. If you don't like the concept, post why you don't like it. And both categories of people, post how you think the idea can be improved.

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#14: Re: Directory structure?

by SheeEttin on 07/07/2008 00:11, refers to #12

Yeah. I've been thinking about just setting up something on Quadropolis (or getting MeatROme or Quin or somebody with this kind of access) so that the map-upload form has fields for the CFG, screenshot, OGZ... and the packaging is done server-side. Completely skips the problem of user error. (Of course, it'd take a little more effort to support the packaging styles of Sauer, AC, etc.)

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#15: Re: Directory structure?

by MovingTarget on 07/07/2008 00:19, refers to #14

That's an interesting idea, and might work.
I forgot to mention that the ten most recent maps displayed would be only Sauer maps.

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#16: Re: Directory structure?

by SephoD on 07/07/2008 03:09, refers to #15

I really like your idea.

The only thing I would like to add is to include when you download a map through that it is added to the load map menu.

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#17: needs moar prompt

by sdhkjfconorfhdsjk on 07/07/2008 07:25

I think that if you join a game with a map you don't have, it should ask if you want to have sauer search quadropolis and download it for you.

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#18: Re: needs moar prompt

by SheeEttin on 07/07/2008 07:44, refers to #17

There definitely needs to be some support for retrieving maps you don't have.

Maybe Quadropolis is the answer... As people have mentioned many times, just getting it from another user leaves open the great hole of a malicious package. Malicious maps, of course, have no place on Quadropolis.

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#19: ..

by Hirato Kirata on 07/07/2008 08:50

just how would the engine identify that the textures inside the map's cfg are vanilla sauer ones or not? default_map_settings.cfg is NOT an option, as there's plenty of textures that're not referenced in there.
and what about the models, how would you likewise determine if it's a vanilla model, or a custom one?

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#20: Re: ..

by JadeMatrix on 07/07/2008 14:22, refers to #19

When someone makes a modified texture, they're supposed to add it to a separate directory, even if its a "playername_modtex" folder within the original. Modified textures should not be a problem unless the mapmaker is breaking the "rules" of mapmaking.

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#21: Re: needs moar prompt

by MovingTarget on 07/07/2008 16:03, refers to #17

Very good idea.

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#22: Re: needs moar prompt

by jbuk2k7s cookie has gone on 07/07/2008 23:29, refers to #21

Another idea i've had is that sauer automatically checks for nessecary ents like lights, playerstarts, ammoboxes, bases if capture map, flags if ctf map etc, and refuses to upload until these ents are added, it also prompts for a remip, calclight 3, and [that other one that you have to use for lightmaps to work].

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#23: Re: needs moar prompt

by JadeMatrix on 07/07/2008 23:39, refers to #22

If that's the case, then just make a separate app/program... it seems a bit much to include in the actual engine.

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#24: Re: needs moar prompt

by MovingTarget on 07/07/2008 23:46, refers to #22

I think that's going a bit far (Quadropolis allows alpha and beta releases of maps).

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#25: Re: needs moar prompt

by SheeEttin on 07/08/2008 05:02, refers to #24

Yeah.
Besides, that data is stored in the decompressed OGZ, which is often several times larger than the compressed one. It'd be quite a hassle to check.

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#26: Re: ..

by Quin on 09/18/2008 14:50, refers to #26

Anyone interested in pursuing this idea can talk to me in #bloodfrontier on irc.freenode.net - I will be beginning community tool development (Quadropolis, CubePkg, etc) shortly, but I am as of yet to have anyone actually participate.

Quadropolis' codebase has already been uploaded to SVN, and TTF2Font will join it eventually. All community tools will be developed under Quadropolis SF project:

http://sourceforge.net/projects/quadropolis

So, I've done the setting up and preparation, where's everyone else? :P

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#27: Re: ..

by Quin on 09/18/2008 22:50, refers to #26

Follow up: http://cubedev.blogspot.com/2008/09/universally-speaking.html

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#28: Re: ..

by Quin on 09/20/2008 01:01, refers to #28

Because who says? There is an upper limit on what can be crammed into the distributions, people are already complaining about Sauerbraten's size :P It makes sense that only the best make it in, one of the other things that was talked about was a "bonus pack" idea akin to the ones done in Quake and Unreal Tournament - but this is alot of work too because you not only have to personally review each map, but most people don't follow the guidelines when releasing content either.

In the end, an external moderator (or community) approved system would be better, as it opens up the possibilities of inserting new maps into the map rotation automatically. Autodownload isn't going to do much unless someone is sitting there picking maps all the time - and even then, it opens up all sorts of issues - most people just sit and let the rotation go as normal, and you end up playing the same cycle of maps over and over and over and over..

I've been playing regen capture too much, I'm really getting sick of the same map cycle. Heh.

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#29: Re: ..

by Quin on 09/20/2008 01:06, refers to #28

Y'know, in retrospect, it is a real shame you decided to troll around here. You've been tolerated around here because you actually have a genuine interest and intelligence buried in there, and it seems like such a waste of perfectly good energy.

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#30: Re: ..

by tentus_ on 09/20/2008 01:41, refers to #28

I agree that a community mappack would be a boon to the community. I might start a topic asking for opinions on what should be included, and see if I can get permission from the appropriate authors.

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#31: Re: ..

by Quin on 09/20/2008 12:43, refers to #30

A forum topic on Quadropolis too would help capture the people who miss it here too. Get some steam behind it and I'll be glad to throw some resources (and help) at it, could help to have access to the quadropolis sf.net project too.

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#32: separated uploads

by CC_machine#12742398 on 09/23/2008 21:20

much simpler idea:
when uploading to quadropolis, have one upload section for each resource, e.g.

"upload .ogz map file:"
"upload any custom texture(s):"
"upload any custom model(s):"
"upload any other needed resources:"

map would go into base/
textures,models,extras go into packages/mapname/
then, the mapname.cfg file would be scanned for the file references to textures, models etc and change the filepath to be correct;
lastly, quadropolis packages the whole thing into a mapname.zip with just the folders packages and base and stuff in them.

just an idea.

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#33: ..

by Osbios on 09/25/2008 18:01

@CC_machine#12742398:
This would be a pain in the ass if you have lots of custom content. You have to fill in every single file.

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