Sauerbraten rated worst Open Source FPS?

by SanHolo on 12/30/2007 22:54, 131 messages, last message: 11/25/2017 23:24, 118416 views, last view: 04/25/2024 12:11, closed on 11/25/2017 23:38

There's an article over at Slashdot that links a report of linux-gamers.net which compared 7 open source shooters. Since the site is slashdotted ATM, all I can get from /. is the ranking: (best to worst) Warsow, Tremulous, World of Padman, Nexuiz, Alien Arena, OpenArena, and Sauerbraten.

I hope the site will be back online soon to see their arguments... :P

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#1: ..

by geartrooper2 on 12/30/2007 23:10

In this business you must remember that the opinion of a select few will not always regard someone's work in the best light.

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#2: ..

by hicks on 12/30/2007 23:18

Yeah, Sauerbraten is very unrated. The rest of those games are a joke when compared to Sauerbraten. Tremulous and Warsow are the exceptions that are at a near level to Sauerbraten.

Anyway game reviewers just want attention and have zero credibility. Just go to 1up.com and look at the 10/10 Halo 3 while UT3 gets an 8/10. Look to Gamespot's recent firing of reviewer that gave a poor score to a game that was advertised on the site.

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#3: hm...

by rock.n.rol_ on 12/30/2007 23:19

now i'm curious about their arguments, too.

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#4: I think they actually liked it

by SATAN!!!@# on 12/30/2007 23:21

If its the article Im thinking of, it actually said that Saur was one of 4 out of the 7 that were worth checking out. I think one comment was \\\"...of all these, we hope Saur grows the most...\\\"

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#5: ..

by SanHolo on 12/30/2007 23:50

The following linked comment seems to have the summary of the website's review. Looks like Sauer made it for the last spot because of the "tech demo feel", but they make a fair note that it is under heavy development and has graphics that rival Quake 4:
http://games.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=401914&cid=21859556

Seems like a good point and actually a fair rating in view of a gamer not interested in developing a game but in playing it.

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#6: Re: ..

by Drakas on 12/31/2007 00:40, refers to #5

The guy OBVIOUSLY hasn't heard of the Woop clan ("there isn't much of a community following") ;-)

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#7: ..

by rancor on 12/31/2007 01:37

It looks like the reviewer looked at an old version of Sauerbraten (Summer Edition IIRC), and missed all of the innovative gametypes Sauerbraten offers in multiplayer. His review of Nexuiz also somehow managed to miss the laggyness that has characterized my experiences with it.

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#8: Not the worst!!!!!!!!

by sepht on 12/31/2007 02:44

I wrote the article and I'd like to say, Oh please don't take it that way!!
I think sauer is a great project. In terms of engine work, you guys have done the most, you also probably have the nicest looking and most polished engine
In terms of artwork you have fairly good art direction and good sounds, models, textures.
The map editor is plain awesome!
The only thing is that when I tried it last (christmas edition and september edition), it still hadn't done much on gameplay.

I wrote that article trying to judge games by gameplay, innovation and then presentation. I personally love sauer but (when I wrote the article) it didn't really have strong gameplay, it was Cube 1 FFA and instagib mostly. I mentioned which version I looked at and I noted that sauer released a new version since I wrote the article (look at the bottom)

I think you guys have done far more in creating a good engine than anyone else there(Although jal and vic's work with qfusion for warsow is also impressive). I think graphically you're top notch, but when I wrote this review, it was thin on gameplay.

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#9: Indeed

by Quin on 12/31/2007 06:57, refers to #8

When you look at the others in the list, they're all based on id tech 3, Sauerbraten is the only "original" game in the list.

I totally understand your gripes with the gameplay, but in Sauerbraten it is very much intentional ("You shoot stuff, the end"), even I am not a big fan of actually //playing// it. From a technical standpoint Cube Engine 2 is a pioneer of its field in the open source community, and a great base for anyone with the guts to try making their own game.

Sauerbraten has a small but dedicated community, and I have seen it flourish with activity over the last year and a half. I don't know if you checked Quadropolis (http://www.quadropolis.us/) - which is our mapping/modding community.

If you're interested in seeing the modding side of Sauerbraten, and how it is capable of doing so much for a developer, then I suggest look up my former project, SauerMod, and my current one, Blood Frontier (http://www.bloodfrontier.com).

To those of you who would criticise an article like this; knock it off. Yeah Sauerbraten is great, but then people like the established stability and 'final' nature of id tech 3 (and there are pros/cons there too, as there is here), and neither are the be-all-and-end-all, just more great alternatives to open source gaming.

The complexity of the Cube project is a barrier to alot of people who try it, and most don't understand how to do even the most basic things. So, how about helping them to get the full experience of the engine? (instead of just complaining that they didn't even look at it, probably due to the fact they didn't even know about it)

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#10: ..

by Acord on 12/31/2007 09:40

Any publicity is good publicity, really. And the down and dirty fact is that an engine can actually be substandard, have a shit art pipeline, cost money, and it will be touted as the end all of game design if someone designs even ONE good game with it.

Yes, I'm talking about Torque.

Sauer is an excellent engine, but it needs a showpiece really really bad. That's all that this is about, really. It's easily got the muscle to kick the hell out of Q3 based games, but nobody can see that from what's already there.

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#11: ..

by Acord on 12/31/2007 09:48

Besides which, there are a shit ton of free FPS games. That puts sauer in the top ten, which makes me warm inside.

Can anyone tell that I started drinking already? It's not too obvious, is it?

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#12: Re: ..

by JadeMatrix on 12/31/2007 14:02, refers to #10

What kind of showpiece?

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#13: RE:

by +DarkStar+ on 12/31/2007 16:28

Tremulous is awful compared to SB. The only features I enjoyed were the aliens ability to crawl on walls and the concept of building things.
The controls were awkward and crippling, most of the textures are also used by SB, and the range of levels were pretty dull.

Single Player needs development, and after a while of taking pot shots at each other it\\\'s a little wearing, but with so many people throwing new ideas and concepts into the cooking pot, it\\\'s really got potential to grow into something just as good as a commercial game.

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#14: ..

by Drakas on 12/31/2007 22:54

Let's see...
OpenArena - what the hell..
Alien Arena - seriously, just boring
Nexuiz - Erm, boring as well
Padman - Haven't tried
Tremulous - Absolutely horrible
Warsow - pretty sweet
Sauerbraten - pwnage of all :)

my review done :)

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#15: Re: ..

by Drakas on 12/31/2007 22:57, refers to #14

Geez, how could I miss AssaultCube? It's #1!

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#16: ..

by HashBox2 on 01/01/2008 00:24

Just for the hell of it I'll copy Drakas and give my own small review also.

OpenArena - Good idea, handy project if you're looking to create a standalone game based off Quake 3 (can just use the textures from here)
Alien Arena - Engine wise, not bad, for a Quake 2 engine, has some shader effects etc, but the game itself wasn't much to me.
Nexuiz - I liked the look and feel of the game, but it ran too horribly on my system to be worth playing.
Padman - Haven't tried this but doesn't look terrible special.
Tremulous - Quite liked this, but never played online so I cant actually comment on the gameplay.
Warsow - One of my most favourite games, has the only type of FPS movement I really enjoy.
Sauerbraten - Even though I cant play with shaders on, Sauerbraten has the coolest feature of any FPS, inbuilt map editing :D especially coop editing :D

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#17: Re: ..

by Quin on 01/01/2008 07:52, refers to #16

"Warsow - pretty sweet"

"Warsow - One of my most favourite games, has the only type of FPS movement I really enjoy."

I'd be interested in an elaboration on that, as research for Blood Frontier's gameplay and dynamics.

What makes it that fun? What does it hold over Cube style of play? What suggestions would you make?

Yes I've played Warsow briefly, so no need to be too verbose, but I am interested in an evaluation from a Cuber's point of view.

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#18: Re: ..

by jbuk2k7 somewhere else on 01/01/2008 16:26, refers to #17

I hate Warsow's movement style. I would prefer it if you just ran all the time, and had to press a key to walk rather than to run. Also, all the characters look stupid and have stupid pain sounds.

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#19: ..

by James007 on 01/01/2008 17:43

i dont think its worth arguing over which of the free open fps's are better. each have there good and bad points. i honestly dont see whats so dang special about warsow tho, it didnt seem that cool to me.

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#20: Re: ..

by MovingTarget on 01/01/2008 18:02, refers to #17

What's so cool about WarSow's movement?

Well, for one, it provides you with so many options to get away from someone, dodge, etc., all crucial to staying alive.

With Sauer, all you can do is run at a fixed speed, maybe do some bunnyhopping (doh!), or turn around and shoot the h*** out of the f****** bastard that is trying to kill you (preferable).

With WarSow, if there is a ramp near, do a ramp jump, if you are in a hall, strafe jumping with a few wall jumps stuck in, circle jump, if you are in front of a wall and have the mg, climb up, etc.

Plus it introduces the 'race' mode, where it is required for you to have trick-jumping skillz.

Those are some of the things I thought of right now.

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