Team killing

by sal on 12/24/2006 15:53, 68 messages, last message: 01/27/2007 11:15, 15005 views, last view: 05/18/2024 03:26

Every time I play a multiplayer game, I always seem to get players (mostly unnamed) fragging me, when we are on the same team. I am not the only person affected by this, and I am sure you know just how frustrating it is.

Is it possible to do one of the following in Sauerbraten?

1. Put a notice at the start of a multiplayer game to say something along the lines of "The blue players are on your team. Red is your enemy."

2. (This may already be possible) Allow admins of servers to enter their own message which appears at the start of every multiplayer game. This would allow them to put a notice saying what they want, perhaps giving the link to their website, and more importantly, the ONLY SHOOT RED message.

I think the message needs to be big, across the screen. It only needs to be displayed for a couple of seconds, though of course that's my personal choice.

---

While posting, I have thought of another idea, though I am sure it will split some people. Democratic kicking.

If a player continues to team-kill, or is a general negative presence (perhaps trolling, flaming, etc) there should be some way to remove them from the game. A democratic kick function would be ideal. For example, go in to the menu, choose who should be kicked, and wait for votes. Other players can vote for or against, and the offending player will either stay or go. It should not wait for every player to vote, since some people won't bother. Similarly, if unnamed can't even change their name, then they won't be able to work out how to vote. I don't know the maths, but it should be possible to work out what percentage is needed without everyone voting.

Just a couple of ideas.

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#1: Re: ..

by sal on 12/24/2006 18:07, refers to #1

What if the server admin is not playing? The democratic kick idea I suggested is for use by all players, especially when the admin is not around.

As for your comment about helping people learn to play before kicking, I completely agree. However, my patience wears thin after I continually type "DO NOT SHOOT BLUE", "ONLY SHOOT RED", "BLUE IS YOUR TEAM. RED IS YOUR ENEMY" and the players still shoot anyone in sight. I can't think of a way to make it any more simple to understand, nor can I do any more to help them learn how the game works.

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#2: ..

by Soulsliver on 12/24/2006 23:44

a friendly fire option would do. also a colored symbol in the hud would be usefull to show what team the player is on.

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#3: ..

by SanHolo on 12/25/2006 00:30

I have a keybinding set to [say "RED = ENEMY and BLUE = TEAM"]. Sadly, that doesn't help always...

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#4: I think...

by Aardappel_ on 12/25/2006 12:35

The best would be, esp in capture mode, to have a spawn time penalty. Right now it says "you have to wait N more seconds to respawn" when you click, it could additionally say "you have a 20 second spawn penalty because you killed a teammate". The penalty could become +10 secs every time the player does it. That should be a very natural way to "teach" them.

And no, we're not going to turn team damage off. That removes a whole layer of strategy.

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#5: Re: I think...

by Drakas on 12/25/2006 13:43, refers to #4

Yeah, good idea :)

On the other hand, I think it'd be the best idea to mod the server to automatically change people's nicknames to say, a random integer or something like that when they are unnamed. So say an unnamed joins - their nick gets changed to "name658" and now the user can be identified. Too, I think server-only mod could be simply changing a team-killer's team. Say the person has made constant team kills (which are straightly recorded) - and after a set amount, they get put to a team "newb" so they'd work only for themselves... Well... also for other newbs :>

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#6: ..

by 1veedo on 12/25/2006 16:58

In BZFlag, by default if you kill a teammate you die.

And if you reach a certain percentage tk/total kills, the server kicks you automatically (not if you only have one or two kills, but after a certain point it'll start kicking you).

Becoming admin is a good idea but I agree with the OP that the server needs to automatically do some of this. In bzflag you dont have these kinds of problems. TKs happen but it's usually followed by "sry" and then "np."

One of these days (after Jan 2) I might see what I can do. Maybe add some cheat protection as well. I always thought sauerbraten could learn a lot from bzflag when it comes to multiplayer.

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#7: ..

by sal on 12/25/2006 19:00

Aardappel_: I like this idea, and I agree that team damage should not be turned off. A clear penalty for team-killing is needed. However, I worry that they wouldn't read it, as players (like myself) make a point of typing help in the game, as I described (things like "BLUE IS YOUR TEAM, ONLY SHOOT RED"). If they don't read that, will they read the penalty notice?

Drakas sweetie: Brilliant idea to automatically rename the unnamed players. A similar idea I thought of was for servers not to accept anyone with the name "unnamed". When the server rejects them, it could give them a message with instructions on how to change their name (it's not hard!).

As for your idea about putting them on a seperate team, I don't think that would be a good idea. If they team-killed and got put on their own team, then they would get the impression they are meant to kill everyone, which is against the idea of team play. I feel that it would not teach them how to play properly.

1veedo: We are in agreement that the server needs to automatically manage some of these things for us. I also agree and recognise that team-kills do happen accidentally, and it's always polite to apologise. The odd team-kill is not a problem - it is the players who shoot anyone in sight and constantly do it which needs to be sorted.

Merry Christmas, everybody :)

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#8: Re: ..

by hampus_ on 12/25/2006 20:05, refers to #7

"Aardappel_: I like this idea, and I agree that team damage should not be turned off. A clear penalty for team-killing is needed. However, I worry that they wouldn't read it, as players (like myself) make a point of typing help in the game, as I described (things like "BLUE IS YOUR TEAM, ONLY SHOOT RED"). If they don't read that, will they read the penalty notice?"
They will probably notice after a while that it takes longer and longer for them to spawn, and then they would be more observant and look after messages. This is also good against people who TK intentionlly.

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#9: ..

by SanHolo on 12/25/2006 20:52

Maybe it would help if important messages like "you fragged a teammate" would appear in the middle of the screen in a fat font.

Even long-time-players like me often miss server-messages top-left, especially when there are many frags and the message disappears rapidly.

The +10 seconds delay is a good idea, nevertheless.

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#10: Re: ..

by Drakas on 12/25/2006 21:08, refers to #9

yeah, a big message popping up would be really good :)

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#11: meh..

by CC_machine-cookie#43697397635625369834526314875265082756458 on 12/25/2006 23:38

there should be something to force-feed newb players. new people rearely RTFM, so..

im for the idea of a TK message in big screen font, would help newbs in the above fashion.

i always kick (persistant)TKers from games, esp. if they're unnameds, they shuldn't be playing if they dont know how to play properly.

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#12: Re: meh..

by rancor on 12/26/2006 03:27, refers to #11

Yeah, I tend to do that too. One thing that would help with that would be showing the client number afer the name in messages if you were master. Right now, its difficult to figure out which unnamed to kick.

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#13: Re: meh..

by Drakas on 12/26/2006 08:11, refers to #12

Dreadnought has already implemented that. As he did it, he wanted to be able to also see people's nicknames above their heads bigger. He made them nearer and created a funny wall hack ;).

http://cpp.od5.co.uk/163/txt/ < diff code. I think its the one. Enjoy!

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#14: Re: meh..

by rancor on 12/26/2006 10:30, refers to #13

Thanks, that's going into the list of things I wish got merged.

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#15: Re: meh..

by kurtis84 on 12/26/2006 14:03, refers to #14

I think unnamed players should not be able to play...should be stuck in observer mode until they choose a name. As for the team-mate killers, take 50% of their health away each time they shoot or kill a teammate.

My 2 cents.

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#16: ..

by SanHolo on 12/26/2006 15:02

Maybe even a simple dialog if one launches the game and his name is "unnamed"? The rules are too simple, it could look like that:

____________________________
| Enter your name: _________
|
| Do NOT shoot BLUE players!
|
| [OK]
|___________________________

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#17: Re: meh..

by Passa on 12/27/2006 13:26, refers to #15

'unnamed' players and 'Player' players appear in all sorts of free online games. Doing something like that would unfortunately discourage new players.. we were all newbs once :)

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#18: Re: meh..

by Drakas on 12/27/2006 14:29, refers to #15

Bad. new people should be encouraged to use the game, really.

I'll work on some server code to automatically rename unnameds to a randomly generated nick that would make bit of sense :)

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#19: Re: meh..

by Drakas on 12/27/2006 14:31, refers to #18

I'll use names from this list :)
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/List_of_people_by_name
LoL

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#20: conan

by conorkirkkirkirkrkirkrkrirkrrkrirk on 12/27/2006 20:14

That would be funny


"OMGWTF MY NAME IS CONAN O BRIAN WTF!!!!"

Or

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